Predestination

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Predestination

The word predestine/predestined/predestinated... appears 4 times in the Bible (KJV), in the verses below (this is not counting occurrences of the terms elected, chosen, etc.):

  1. Eph 1:5
  2. Eph 1:11
  3. Rom 8:29
  4. Rom 8:30

What does predestine mean? Kevin Thompson (KT) points out that Historical Theology by Alistair McGrath defines predestination as God's ordaining from eternity who will be saved and who will not. 1

This is how Augustine defined it. Is this the definition of the term in scripture? KT says it is not. 2

KT says pre-destine means

For a destination to be decided [- destine] beforehand [pre -].

This short article deals with presdestination, not election. KT says they are different; predestination does not equal election. See ELECTION: It's Nothing Like You Were Told (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0TUH60Cd78)

The problem with this definition

The problem with this definition of the word is that it assumes

  1. who performs the predestining (God)
  2. who is being predestined (sinners)
  3. to what they are predestined (new birth / salvation)

Reading the above 3 things into the scripture, on the basis of one's presupposition, is called eisegesis. While eisegesis is inserting ideas into scripture, exegesis is getting ideas from scripture. Obviously, to understand the Bible, one should do exegesis, not eisegesis.

2 (not the only) views - regarding those who get saved

  1. Arminianism says God predestines salvation, because God knows the choice of sinners.
  2. Calvinism says God predestines salvation, because God predestines the choice of sinners. 3

They both say that God predestines the result - salvation (or not) - though for different reasons. Both these views (or "-isms") assume the following:

Assumptions of Calvinism and of Arminianism

  1. who predestines -> God
  2. who is being predestined - the sinner
  3. to what are they predestined - salvation of the soul

We shall examine scripture to see if these 3 assumptions are found in scripture.

Now, let's look at those 4 scriptures that mention forms of the word predestine.

The 4 Scriptures

1st scripture: Eph 1:5

Eph 1:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, 

The predestination in this verse is to adoption.

Is adoption getting born again, saved? Per scripture, Rom 8:23 says the saved ones wait for adoption, so this is not getting saved; otherwise already saved people are waiting to get saved! If adoption is predestined, and this adoption is not salvation - then what is it?

Rom 8:23 says adoption is the redemption of the body. 4

See below [bold emphasis mine]

Rom 8:23 And not only [they], but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, [to wit], the redemption of our body

Note that redemption is in the future, for saved people, in Eph 1:13-14.

Eph 1:13-14 In whom ye also [trusted], after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, 14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Note that redemption is also in the future, for saved people, in Eph 4:30:

Eph 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

Per Eph 1:1 Paul is writing to saved people. So, Eph 1:5 is not lost people predestined to be saved, but saved people predestined to the redemption of the body.

2nd scripture: Eph 1:11

Eph 1:11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will: 

Compare with I Pet 1:4-9:

I Pet 1:4-5

4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, 5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. ...  

Note "in the last time" in v 5. This indicates future

Eph 1:11 is saying that the predestination is that of saved people to their predestined future inheritance in heaven.

3rd & 4th scriptures: The last 2 verses - Rom 8:29 and 30

Rom 8:29-30 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate [to be] conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Could conformed to the image of his Son in Rom 8:29-30 refer to being like Jesus? This seems likely. See I John 3:2:

I John 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appearwe shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

Could being like Jesus in I John 3:2 above refer to getting our spiritual bodies? The words not yet imply future. The future event is to be like Jesus. This is what is predestined - to be like Jesus. This is predestined for saved people ("now are we the sons of God"), who are predestined to be like Jesus. This is not saying lost people are predestined to be saved. This is written to saved people (the "Beloved" who are "the sons of God" in I John 3:2), not to lost people.

This is not the lost predestined to be saved; this is the saved being predestined to be like Jesus! 5

These verses illustrate that to be conformed to the image of his Son is the meaning of glorified per KT. 

KT says 

  1. adoption
  2. redemption of the body
  3. conformity to the image of Christ
  4. glorification

all refer to a single simultaneous event to which the believer is predestined.

And the Bible per these scriptures does not support the Calvinistic view of predestination.

Questions answered above, regarding these scriptures:

  1. who is being predestinated in the context?
  2. to what are they being predestinated?
  3. how does scripture define that destination? [refer to other scriptures]

Summary

Eph 1:5

already saved people are predestined to adoption / redemption of the body

Eph 1:11

already saved people are predestined to their heavenly inheritance

Rom 8:29-30

already saved people are predestined to be glorified / conformed to the image of Christ

KT's questions:

  1. Does Augustine's idea of predestination as God's pre-selecting who will be saved ahead of time match any of the above scriptures?
  2. Does Calvin's idea of predestination as salvation and damnation being predetermined from the beginning match any of the above scriptures?
  3. Does Arminius' idea of predestination as God's predestining people to get saved or not, based on God's foreknowledge of who will accept Christ, match any of the above scriptures?
  4. Does Southern Baptist Traditionalism's idea of predestination as God's predestining a predetermined redemptive plan of God to justify, sanctify and glorify whosoever freely believes, match any of the above scriptures? The plan might be ok as what God planned, but this is not what the word predestine means where it is used in the 4 verses where the word predestine/predestines/predestined/etc. appears in scripture.

In scripture, KT says, none of the above is stated in those predestination verses; individual Christians are predestined to their future inheritance and glorification.

  • 1. For a video explaining predestination, see Kevin Thompson's 

    Predestination: It's Nothing Like You Were Told

    (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jTf58y5ZKg)

  • 2. Definition of predestine per 1828 Webster's dictionary:

    To decree beforehand; to foreordain. http://www.webstersdictionary1828.com/Dictionary/predestine

  • 3. The relevant point is that sinners are predestined to be born again.
  • 4. See I Cor 15:42 - 54

    44 ... There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. ... 49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. ... 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal [must] put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

  • 5. Note on foreknow: https://creation-controversy.com/comment/33#comment-33
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Note on foreknow

 God's knowing happens when? After a person gets saved, or in eternity past? See Gal 4:8-9...

Gal 4:8-9

"4:8 Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods. 9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?"

Nowafter that ye are known of God, implies they were not known of God before. Since their knowing God refers to God's knowing them, then it would seem their not knowing God, refers to God's not knowing them. There was therefore a time when they did not Know God, implying a time when God did not know them. Thus this verse implies God did not know them from all eternity past, but rather, knew them when they got saved.

This indicates foreknow likely is not referring to God knowing the person would get saved ahead of time, says KT. If foreknow does refer to God's knowing ahead of time, it still repudiates Calvinism as noted below.

If foreknow in Rom 8:29 means God predestined because he foreknew man's choice, then the election per Calvinism becomes conditional, based on man's choice, rather than God's arbitrary will. Then foreknowing man's choice is a prerequisite for predestination in this verse. This invalidates Calvinism since being saved would then be conditional on man's choice, while Calvinism states this is unconditional.

Is this Romans 8 about the future conversion of a lost sinner? or about the guaranteed future of saved people?

Therefore what God foreknows, per KT, is the future guaranteed glorification of the believer as though already conformed to Jesus' image. 

Why is this glorification past tense? Calling things that be not as though they were. Rom 8:18 refers to glorification as a future event. 

Rom 8:18 - For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.